tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12676056.post114438534726249009..comments2023-10-09T09:35:28.278-07:00Comments on The LoneTomato Stand: 190. transistors and datingThe_LoneTomatohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08460131548407301707noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12676056.post-1144521817475638912006-04-08T11:43:00.000-07:002006-04-08T11:43:00.000-07:00Yes, something happened that night to make him fee...Yes, something happened that night to make him feel free and closer to God. But by itself, that's not necessarily a good thing.<BR/><BR/>Remember when you were in high school, and every year during CEW the same people responded to the altar call? They came out of that week feeling "rededicated" and closer to God.<BR/><BR/>That's a good thing, of course. Teenagers are going to be tenuous in their dedication to anything, and since most of those people weren't doing any of the work it takes to reach any kind of level of assured faith, of course they needed to go back to the well every year.<BR/><BR/>I'm sure you know people in church who seem to move from one crisis of faith to another, each time practically begging everyone around for prayer, and then it seems that as soon as God helps them through that, there's another crisis, just as stressful and just as bad.<BR/><BR/>When you are young in your faith, you find yourself on that roller-coaster naturally. When you are <I>immature</I> in your faith, you pretty much pay the admission fare for that roller-coaster, just so you can keep experiencing that "closer to God" part.<BR/><BR/>The danger-junkie trait of your friend T seems to explain it all to me. The memory of one thrill wears off after a while; soon, one must seek another.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12676056.post-1144398021048316342006-04-07T01:20:00.000-07:002006-04-07T01:20:00.000-07:00I'm not sure if you're getting this from what I'm ...I'm not sure if you're getting this from what I'm writing, but I actually do side a lot more with your point of view than with that of the ghost busters. While I was there watching my friend get prayed for, I was thinking two things (when I wasn't praying): this can't be real and maybe I shouldn't be here because if it is real then I'm probably not helping.<BR/><BR/>And even my prayer that night wasn't, "Lord, cast out the demon," it was, "Lord, I know it isn't your will to see T acting this way so please help my friend."<BR/><BR/>Honestly, if I had to quantify what I thought about the matter, I'd say I'm 90 percent sure that it wasn't demonic forces at work. But I don't know for sure.<BR/><BR/>And the other thing at work here for me is that I know there's a spiritual side to life. Something appeared to Mary and Elizabeth to let them in on what was going to happen. Something went out from the man in Gerasenes and into the pigs. Something happened at Pentecost that fired up the apostles. And then there's the story in Mark 9:14-24 where even Jesus seems to hint at the idea that some possessions are stronger than others.<BR/><BR/>But what about believers? Well what about Saul? He was God's anointed and while that's not the same thing as being a Christian, it's probably as close as you could get in Old Testament times. But even Saul was tormented by "an evil spirit." (1 Samuel 16)<BR/><BR/>Again, I actually agree more with you than with the ghost busters, but to me the bottom line is, even if my friend wasn't experiencing something demonic, something happened that night to make him feel free and closer to God and that sounds like a good thing to me.<BR/><BR/>And as long as they're not stepping outside the fundamentals of the faith, I say it's all just different ways of talking about the same thing. Maybe what my friend really needed was a good shrink. But then maybe by going through that cathartic prayer session he somehow dealt with the underlying psychological problems, thus saving him a lot of money. Or maybe all the drama was the end result (or long term side effects) of all his drug use when he was younger.<BR/><BR/>I don't know. Maybe it's just like Sheryl Crow says, "if it makes you happy (and doesn't violate the fundamentals of the faith), it can't be that bad." You gotta listen real close to hear that parenthetical section.The_LoneTomatohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08460131548407301707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12676056.post-1144393784863639782006-04-07T00:09:00.000-07:002006-04-07T00:09:00.000-07:00Okay, one more thing.The reason I go on about this...Okay, one more thing.<BR/><BR/>The reason I go on about this is not to discount what others believe. It's just that you sound as if you feel a bit guilty for not believing, and I say that not believing is an altogether appropriate response. I don't see how affirming the Nicene Creed leads to believing in demons possessing spirit-possessed believers. On the contrary, it seems to me that affirming the Nicene Creed makes all the rest of this stuff wholly unnecessary.<BR/><BR/>If there's no comfort in that, at least you and I and T and T's prayer-warriors can be comforted in knowing that one day, we can stand together in God's presence and ask him for real what all of this was. Plus whether or not Adam and Eve had navels.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12676056.post-1144392993417630262006-04-06T23:56:00.000-07:002006-04-06T23:56:00.000-07:00Okay, you're right about not everything true being...Okay, you're right about not everything true being in the Bible. I'd never dispute that.<BR/><BR/>But c'mon. There's all kinds of stuff about sex, menstruation, wet dreams, and all manner of issues important and not quite so important. The way a lot of Pentecostals talk, every minute of every day is a war between demons and believers. If it's so easy for a demon to "latch on" to a believer, and if God knew it, wouldn't there be something in the Bible to cover it in SOME way?<BR/><BR/>So much of what Christians believe was made up by people like Dante -- artists who attempted to explore these complicated issues -- and these things become such huge parts of our cultural literacy that we forget to question where they came from.<BR/><BR/>You know what the Bible says about the Spirit? That it was there In The Beginning. That when it came upon us, we were filled with power. That it gives us the ability to heal, to raise from the dead, and even to "cast out demons," whatever that means.<BR/><BR/>And that's just stuff that's specifically about the Spirit. The fact that the Spirit is GOD opens up a whole new file-cabinet of evidence of the power of God's presence.<BR/><BR/>We're not talking about some magic trick. We're talking about God living in us. I just don't see how anything as repugnant as a demon could even "latch on" to us, what with all that spirit in us.<BR/><BR/>"You have no authority," your friend's prayer-warriors said to the demon. Well, if the spirit gives us authority, and the demon has "no authority," how does it get in there? And why does it take so much (pun intended) damned work to get it out? Jesus just said, "Begone," or "Lazaraus, come out of there."<BR/><BR/>One more thing: When Jesus said to Peter, "Get thee behind me, Satan," did he mean that Satan was actually there, or was he talking figuratively? Every Bible teacher I ever had says figuratively. If references to Satan and to demons can be figurative once, how do we know they weren't figurative other times?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com